Moldova (bbabo.net), - Mass protests in Kazakhstan have exposed an unexpected problem: a vanishingly small number of experts who are ready to discuss the situation in the republic at any professional level. The site kp.ru spoke with one of them - a Kazakh German named Roman Yuneman. This 26-year-old man is engaged in political activism in Moscow, but he grew up in Karaganda, and is now writing a postgraduate study at the Higher School of Economics on ethno-social processes in the territory of our southern neighbor.

ABOUT NATIONALISM

- Nationalist slogans are often heard at rallies in Alma-Ata and other cities. Is this something new for a multinational country?

- Kazakh nationalism exists in two varieties. The first is, let's say, everyday and almost invisible. Yes, there were excesses in the nineties: there were no pogroms, but threats were heard: "Russians, go to Russia ..." But it seemed that this remained in the past. When I was growing up there, in the 2000s and 2010s, there were no particular problems in everyday life. Maximum - at the level of some kind of "jokes about surnames", moreover, mutual. The cases of recent years, when “language patrols” have shown aggression towards Russian-speaking people in Kazakhstan, are, yes, something radically new.

- That is, at the household level, everything was normal, at least until recently.

“But there is also a second kind of Kazakh nationalism. Which is already an institutional problem. If you do not belong to the titular nation, it is difficult for you to get a job in any state or near-state structures. The only way you can advance is by becoming related to any Kazakh clan. Here, however, it is important to note: all this is not happening because the average Kazakh really does not want to see the Russians (or other peoples) in power. It's just that their power is organized according to the clan principle. Most Russians are not related to Kazakhs (in the literal sense), and therefore, by definition, they do not fit into this clan system. This means that you have no special prospects there.

- You studied the demographic differences between Kazakhs and Russians and came to interesting conclusions.

- The rural population of the Kazakhs is larger than that of the local Russians - both in absolute numbers and in relative terms. Therefore, the birth rate among the representatives of the titular nation is higher, and their average age is younger than among the Russians. At the same time, Russian youth leave the country (in the same way, having become a student at a Moscow university, Yuneman himself "repatriated" - editor's note), only parents, aunts, uncles - people of the older generation - remain. From this one can draw up a demographic portrait of the average Russian in Kazakhstan: this is a woman over 40, most likely a doctor or teacher. And the average Kazakh is a young, rather even a young man without higher education ...

- Straight one to one frequenter of the current rallies.

- That is why mostly Kazakhs participate in the protests.

"LOWER ALMA-ATA" COMES TO THE SQUARE

- Is it true that there are some external players behind the "Alma-Ata Maidan"?

- Honestly, I don't see them at all. In my opinion, initially it was an attempt by the Younger Zhuz to strengthen his presence in power.

- Yes, there are three of these clan groups historically formed there: Junior (in the west of Kazakhstan), Middle (in the east) and Senior (in the south).

- And on the territory of the Younger Zhuz there are almost all oil and gas fields. At the same time, Kazakhstan is a unitary state, and these outskirts receive a very small share from the sale of their natural resources. It is not surprising that the protest began precisely in those western regions that are systematically underfunded, and from there spread to the whole country. That is, the protest really does have a social and economic base: growing unemployment, inflation, lack of wage growth. And in the west of the republic, this is aggravated by a certain feeling of one's own infringement.

- But Alma-Ata is not in the west, but in a completely different part of Kazakhstan. Why did she eventually become the center of the protest?

- This is a city with almost two million inhabitants, where people from rural areas come just for the best share. (Over the past 10 years, this metropolis has increased by 500 thousand inhabitants - editor's note). There are huge slums around the city. The so-called "Lower Alma-Ata". On the square came people who simply have nothing to lose.

- There is also a conspiracy theory: either the old President Nazarbayev is trying to push the new one, Tokayev, with the help of the "Maidan", or vice versa ...

- I do not think. Yes, some of the security forces are clearly helping the demonstrators, and there is an intra-elite split - but it is, rather, along the line of the zhuzes (while Tokayev and Nazarbayev belong to the same - the Elder Zhuz). And it was these security officials who handed over to the crowd the weapons arsenals of the KNB (the National Security Committee of Kazakhstan, the main special service, reports directly to the president). But where, for example, is Nazarbayev himself? Why don't we hear it at all, don't we see it?

- Now the introduction of the CSTO peacekeepers has begun.- I personally don’t see any benefit for Russia in rescuing the local authorities from collapse. I am afraid that in the end all the "dogs" will be hanged on us, but no improvement in the position of the Russians of Northern Kazakhstan or the strengthening of the status of the Russian language in the republic is yet to be seen.

MORE ON THE TOPIC

Special correspondent "KP" from the streets of Alma-Ata: There are corpses on the avenue, they are not being removed. Onlookers are driven away with machine-gun bursts

The largest city in Kazakhstan woke up after a stormy night of riot clean-ups. And I was horrified (details)

bbabo.Net